1860 Pietta 44 Navy to 45lc with Kirst

[AlaskanGuy]

Well, my first Kirst came in via float plane today.. I excitedly opened the package, and got the extractor, cylinder and loading port ring. Fit it to my Pietta was fairly straight foreword after a bit of tweaking... no endshake, with the finger test. But wow, I look at the amount of material that has to come off to be able to actually use the loading port is a bit un-nerving.... wow.. I wish there was a video or something of somebody actually doing this.. I have grown particularly fold of this particular Pietta. I have several others in various designs, and have worked over guns of many types over the years, but this much material to remove is making me sweat.

Anybody got an instructable on how they did theirs with real pictures?? I have all the right tools.. just having trouble with Courage. Can I get a pill or bottle for that?

AG

[AntiqueSledMan]

Hello AlaskanGuy,

Here is a link showing an 1851 being done.

http://www.hobbygunsmith.com/Archives/May04/Feature.htm

hope this helps, AntiqueSledMan.

[ssb73q]

Hi AG, if doing an 1860 you may want to see this thread:

http://blackpowdersmoke.com/colt/index.php?topic=3022.msg30735#msg30735

The 5-shot .45 Colt in the Pietta 1860 is a royal PITA. The Howell 1851 is much easier:

http://blackpowdersmoke.com/colt/index.php?topic=3056.msg31223#msg31223

These threads had lots of Flickr photos now lost. I'll see what photos I still have on my computer.

I have done five gated conversions and own twenty one non gated conversion cylinders so I have some conversion cylinder experience and will be happy to answer any of your questions.

Good luck with your project.

Regards,
Richard

[AlaskanGuy]

Wow, thanks guys... I don’t believe that the Howell does a gated 44 for the Pietta navy types. I wanted a gate for this gun. So thanks Richard. I will prolly be starting this job on Monday, when My back is too screwed up to go fishing for a couple days.. lol

[ssb73q]

Hi AG, you are correct, Howell doesn't make a gated .45 Colt conversion cylinder. I had asked them if they would make one in the future, the answer no. The Howell gated conversion cylinder I referenced is their 38 Colt/38 Special used in the 1851. Screwing down the conversion cylinder ring allows for much easier headspacing compared to the floating ring Kirst. I see that Kirst now has a gated conversion cylinder for the Remington 1858 that allows screwing down the cylinder ring. They're learning. LOL

Regards,
Richard

[AlaskanGuy]

Richard? Did you put those blade sights on your 1851’s? They look tall and not as wide as the ones most use.

[ssb73q]

Hi AG, most all BP revolvers shoot high with C&B. Shooting heavier projectiles has the revolvers shoot even higher. Since I shoot all my different 54 revolvers, I don't want to shoot and then figure Kentucky windage to bring the projectiles on target. I want them to hit dead center from the first round fired to the last fired. I put taller dovetail sights on most of my revolvers. Yes, a couple of the 1860s use taller blade sights. If a blade sight ever comes off, a dovetail front sight replacement is done. I have different revolvers sighted in for C&B and conversion cylinders. Also, all my BP revolvers have the rear sight in the hammer widened using a dremel cutoff wheel. This lets me take any of my BP revolvers and hit the X on the first shot. Each revolver has a tag on the gun muff stating what ammo is used to have poi=poa @25yds sighted in.

BTW, all Uberti BP revolvers have short arbors. That condition must be fixed it reproducible accuracy is expected. Most new Pietta's don't have the problem.

Regards,
Richard

[G Dog]

Objection.  Typos happen and that’s OK, we all do that occasionally, but let us at least try to get it right.  Historical nomenclature matters.  (e.g. Navy Yank, 1860 .44 Navy and that sort of thing.)

[AlaskanGuy]

Hmmm... not sure I understand G-dog..

I thought that blade sight was very cool Richard... I will put that on my list to attempt. I did something like that for a 44 mag I normally carry for bear protection. I cast the lee 310’s and rather then try to guess Kentucky windage as you were saying, I just modified the sight.. so maybe after I get my load and bullet stuff figured out, I will inquire on how you did that and material used and so on...

Here is where I am at so far.. one of the reasons I chose this gun, besides how it feels, is that the person I bought if from had taken to walking the wedge out with a screw driver, and it is pretty dinged up to begin with. I will end up removing much of the finish and re-doing at some point,. There are many dents and such that I will need to leave... it will never be purty, but I do want it to function well...

I did notice that there is a bit of binding between the ring, and the cylinder even if it is not installed in the gun. I think it should turn inside the ring when the ring is uninstalled freely??? I think I may have to hone that a bit or polish the inside of that ring?? What do you guys think?

AG

[ssb73q]

Hi AG, the cylinder should not bind in the ring. Your photo shows that you have the frame really hogged out. What happened at the top and bottom of the cutout, over do it? You want to avoid getting too close to the where the arbor is screwed into the frame.

I look forward to your updates.

Regards,
Richard

[ssb73q]

Objection.  Typos happen and that’s OK, we all do that occasionally, but let us at least try to get it right.  Historical nomenclature matters.  (e.g. Navy Yank, 1860 .44 Navy and that sort of thing.)

Hi G Dog, the .45 Colt conversion cylinder can be installed on both an 1860 and .44 1851 (Navy). There is nothing historical about the .44 1851. I understood AG and I bet you did too? IMO lighten up.

Regards,
Richard

[AlaskanGuy]

Yes Richard, anything worth doing is worth overdoing!!!!   

I was looking at your pics an it looked like it was suppost to be that way, but now when I look again I see that the bottom did not need to be touched...  for my gun, I had no choice on the top. I prolly had a choice, but the ring itself loading port position was about 1/4 inch off center when installed where it wanted to sit due to clearance of the top of the loading port. It wouldn’t close properly with the firing pin in top dead center, os I “fixed it”... I guess I was right in being nervous about doing it. But it will be a learning thing. Needs a video somewhere to see how it’s done I guess for a hard head like me.

So on the ring, should I attempt to remove and polish a tiny bit of the inside of it so the cylinder spins without binding??? Or should I wait and call Mr Kirst?

Thanks for the help.

[ssb73q]

Hi AG, I would talk to Kirst first before modifying the cylinder or ring. Kirst guarantees the cylinders for life. One problem I found with the Kirst gated cylinder is that it takes two men and a strong boy to open the loading gate. I disassemble the gate and dremel a coil off the spring. Be careful to not lose the ball the spring pushes against. I now have a couple hundred of those bearing balls if needed. Can you guess why?

Regards,
Richard

[AlaskanGuy]

I’ll call them first before I do anything...

My loading gate seems fine to move back and forth... can use just a little finger pressure to open.. I am sure I got lucky on that one... but if I have to send the ring back, knowing my luck I will need to make that mod on a different ring.

i just pray I can work it together some how. it takes weeks to get something sent here. and I would have to wait till i go to town next time to even send it out.. i cant mail stuff out from here.. only recieve stuff from the mail plane, as he has no method of recieving mail. only drop off. so it would be august before it could even go out, prolly end of September for something to get back or later. 

[AlaskanGuy]

ok, here I am now... almost ready to do a bit of Cold Blueing...