Uberti 1860 conversion

[bigted]

hello everybody. this may just be the craziest post i have ever posted anywhere but here goes anyway;

i have enjoyed my Uberti cimmaron for a couple years now and about a year ago i purchased the Kirst conversion cylinder with the loading gate. i also purchased the ejector rod kit for it but just never fit it all together with the exception of the gated cylinder and find it very accurate as well as a fun departure from the c&b cylinder it came stock with.

this is and has been a very accurate revolver and after some tinkering it is a very smooth action to boot.

so reading the lit. in the cylinder kit and then going online i read also that the design is for blackpowder OR LIKE LOADS. so i have been contemplating this for a couple weeks and today i took 10 of my schofield cases and some 230 .451 inch lead bullets and loaded them with the lowest load i could find being 5.5 grains unique and a large pistol primer.

now i have been shooting blackpowder thru copious revolvers and rifles and the shotgun thrown in from time to time. ALWAYS have downgraded folks that have either asked or actually loaded a muzzle loading firearm with smokeless powder. so here is my hesitation ... i am so ingrained with this bp only revolver ... that even tho i read that it is ok in this conversion ... it still makes me pause.

guess im looking for further confirmation on this new to me loading procedure with my precious model 60 44.

what say yee? kewl or not? ...  ... 

[Kaboom]

I don't have a Kirst cylinder for my Colt 60, but I do have  a Howell cylinder for my 58, I shoot 7.5 Unique under a 200 gr Swc. After 300-400 rounds everything still functions fine. Hope this helps yer jetters.

[bigted]

yep ... it do a bit ... i just needed to hear another admit to this crazy idea that i have held for years is all. makes perfect sense to me as the metal is modern and the pressure is mostly held in the modern cylinder but eeks it seems just an abomination to shoot smokeless in a c&b revolver. no matter what the manufacturer says about it ... still i plan to shoot em tomorrow and look forward to finding out how they will react. 

looks like this ol dog still has some new experiences to go yet ... yippee !!! 

[Kaboom]

Go get'm bigted. Just be sure not to load heavy. They call for Cowboy loads, not not regular full power smokeless loads. My manual called for about 8.5 unique (with a 200gr lswc) as start for smokeless guns, (that's why I went with 7.5) so stay under (but not TOO far under, savy).

[bigted]

yepper ... i will add little by little but have the lightest load loaded now and will plunk a bit more in there but like you i will never go any above the 7.5 grain load.

thanks for the encouragement. ... 

[mazo kid]

Ted, I believe the recommendation is to keep velocity in the 800-850 fps range. I, too, have struggled with the idea of smokeless in my C&B guns, so far only holy black in those conversion cylinders.

[Kaboom]

I also wanted to warn you about going TOO low. I can't explain it like Class, but if you go just a little BELOW 7.5 unique, you COULD have a spontaneous explosion. Yes, an explosion from too little powder. I really don't understand all about it, but with too little, it seems the powder partially ignites, warms it all up, then BAM it all goes off. You have to stay in the window of it's operating pressure curve. Man, I hope I got all that right. Class says never go below 10percent of the minimum or you could run into a solid wall (like with your head). OUCH! If I have some of this incorrect, forgive me, but I wouldn't want ya ta lose a hand or worse with a too light load. In other words, don't go below that 7.5. I wish Class were here to really explain what I'm trying to say. Hope ya understand.

[Captainkirk]

If you are concerned (rightly so!) about using smokeless, why not use Trail Boss? It's considered 'user-friendly' by Howell and (I believe) Kirst as well, as long as velocities are kept under 800fps and is nearly impossible to double charge even on a .45LC case.

[bigted]

trailboss would solve the problem i think. i bought a bunch awhile ago and now looks like it will come in handy. thanks for the tip.

i do know about the lite loaded large case loads but that is with most powders ... unique is just that ... unique in nature as in it is not position sensitive. i have loaded and shot very lite loads of it in the past with my ruger and s&w pistols to good effect. thanks for the reminder on lite loads tho as it is good to remember these things when going where there are shadows lurking. i have loaded 8 grains in a 45-70 case with no filler to hold it against the primer and it works very well and an accurate load at that.

[Captainkirk]

Ted, like you I would be hesitant to use Unique even in reduced loads. 10.5 gr in my .44Mag handloads created recoil and muzzle flash not to be taken lightly. Remember, even though the cylinders are made of modern smokeless-proof steel, the barrels and frames are NOT. I would feel much more comfortable with Trail Boss.

[StrawHat]

Not sure what you have available but a good substitute for fffG is ffG. 

If you are looking for other loads, check out the Cowby Action Shooting site.  Lot's of recipes.

[bigted]

strawhat,

i do have many powders available to me but like you point out... the 2F is and does work just fine... as well as the GOEX cartridge powder i have left.

i read in the literature of the Kirst converter cylinder about the cylinder being rated for blackpowder AND cowboy loads equivalent to the blackpowder loads. so i wanted to try them for grins. i sure dont need the OTHER powder for function nor accuracy as this fine 60 will hold its own with the genuine powder it were designed for.

just a curiosity is all. if the subject of smokeless is to be avoided here then by all means i will not pursue or report my findings or experimentation with the OTHER powder here on "colt country". i have plenty of bp experience and fun time to write about if i have overstepped in any way.

[StrawHat]

I like BP, in all flavors, fG to ffffG!  Not sure if smokelss is frowned upon in this forum or not.  I use it sometimes in cartridges for my Model P and S&W's.  COnversions I treat like C&B revovlers, BP only.  Just a little faster reload.

Just jerking your chain about the ffG as a substitute.

[bigted]

no offense taken in the least friend. i need some chain jerkin from time to time as i seem to have the ability to wonder abroad time to time.

my c&b's all like bp and so the posting about this OTHER powder ... generated from my reading the instructions ... know better then to pay attention to instructions till im so aggravated from going at it without that ... as a last resort i find em and read em to see where i wondered off the path. this is no different tho ... had this kit for at least a year and just about got it working rite and THEN i dug out the instructions and WALLA ... there was this small bit on smokless loads "equivalent" to the bp loads [cowboy loads] ... 

[Captainkirk]

just a curiosity is all. if the subject of smokeless is to be avoided here then by all means i will not pursue or report my findings or experimentation with the OTHER powder here on "colt country". i have plenty of bp experience and fun time to write about if i have overstepped in any way.

Awwww...c'mon. We don't resort to those kinda chickenshit petty rules here. If smokeless is what ya shoot, talk about it. Hell, I load smokeless for all my CF guns.