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Long Guns => Percussion Muskets and Rifles => Topic started by: tljack on June 28, 2021, 11:45:24 AM
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One of my Sharps is a 1859 Berdan by Armi Sports. It is actually a really nice gun, accurate, very good metal t wood fit and good metal polishing.
I have had it for 12 years or more. One of the issues it it has a floating chamber that is supposed to minimize blow back into the shooters' face. After each shooting is is a pain to get freed up.
Recently after shooting it, I was able to get it freed up but it will not completely seat. This is preventing the falling block from going into it's home. I am suspecting that fouling is under the base of it. Do any of you folks have any Idea how I might fix this issue short of removing the barrel?
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I'm just talking off the top of my head here....can you drop the breech out of the gun and get the gas seal out? A friend of mine made a gas seal out of a 10 ga. wad trimmed back to the base; he says it really cut down on fouling. C. Hahn makes a seal conversion and ShotgunDave uses that in his Sharps. Maybe he will elaborate.
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The seal only comes part way out. Otherwise is could fall out when the action is opened. According to the factory diagram, it shows removing the barrel to get it out.
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Ok, it has been many a year since I had my paper cutter Sharps and I never removed the gas seal. Maybe PM ShotgunDave to get his expertise.
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I have the Pedersoli 63 Sharps. It originally had the same style floating chamber in it, that doesn't work very well. Mine has had the Charlie Hahn modification done to it. The chamber is no longer floating, it is stationary. He removes the floating portion and replaces it with a pressed in chamber liner. The breech end is all that "floats" now. It's just a small removable ring with an O ring in it. It cuts down on about 80% of the blow-by of gasses.
If you want to remove the chamber from your rifle to clean it, you'll probably need the little brass chamber tool to remove it. I can't remember if the Armi Sport guns are able to get the chamber sleeve out through the breech, or if the barrel has to be removed. I have the tool here, if you need it. Just PM me your address and I'll send it to you. It's just a two piece cylinder, that is held together with an Allen bolt. It is split in half and goes together on an eccentric. You place it in the chamber. tighten the bolt, and smack the chamber out with a cleaning rod through the muzzle. The tool is brass so it won't harm the chamber. If you need me to, I'll get it out and take a picture if my explanation sucks. LOL!!
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I have the Pedersoli 63 Sharps. It originally had the same style floating chamber in it, that doesn't work very well. Mine has had the Charlie Hahn modification done to it. The chamber is no longer floating, it is stationary. He removes the floating portion and replaces it with a pressed in chamber liner. The breech end is all that "floats" now. It's just a small removable ring with an O ring in it. It cuts down on about 80% of the blow-by of gasses.
If you want to remove the chamber from your rifle to clean it, you'll probably need the little brass chamber tool to remove it. I can't remember if the Armi Sport guns are able to get the chamber sleeve out through the breech, or if the barrel has to be removed. I have the tool here, if you need it. Just PM me your address and I'll send it to you. It's just a two piece cylinder, that is held together with an Allen bolt. It is split in half and goes together on an eccentric. You place it in the chamber. tighten the bolt, and smack the chamber out with a cleaning rod through the muzzle. The tool is brass so it won't harm the chamber. If you need me to, I'll get it out and take a picture if my explanation sucks. LOL!!
Thanks for the offer. I have one of those from Pedersoli somewhere. I have used it in the past however the floating chamber never came completely out. Once I get this back I will just keep it as an example of a Berdan for my collection. I have a Shilo 1863 carbine and a n original 1863 carbine and neither has that part so I will just shoot the Shilo. I do need to be able to close the action.
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I love mine. But it's a Business Rifle and has a long 32" octagon barrel. It's too heavy to carry around. I'd really like to get a carbine one of these days. They are hard to come by though. Seems like there's only one paper cutter to every 100 cartridge rifles.
Have you tried using a dental pick and scraping the front of the floating chamber? There's probably just some hard fouling at the front of the chamber sleeve. Soak it good with a Ballistol/Water mix and get after it with a pick. That might get it moving forward enough to close the breech.
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The barrel has to be removed to take the floating chamber completely out of the gun. I made a tool that would reach in and hook the lip of the chamber so you could tap it rearward to clean between the chamber and the front ledge where the chamber seats.
I can't find a pic of the tool. I sent the tool with the rifle when I sold it.
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I love mine. But it's a Business Rifle and has a long 32" octagon barrel. It's too heavy to carry around. I'd really like to get a carbine one of these days. They are hard to come by though. Seems like there's only one paper cutter to every 100 cartridge rifles.
Have you tried using a dental pick and scraping the front of the floating chamber? There's probably just some hard fouling at the front of the chamber sleeve. Soak it good with a Ballistol/Water mix and get after it with a pick. That might get it moving forward enough to close the breech.
Awh! Balitol! My favorite stuff! Yes I have used it and Kroil. finally got it to free up with brake cleaner. The issue seems to be that it has a build up at the base. I have used a dental pick. thanks for commenting.
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Boy, that floating chamber sure seems like more trouble than it's worth. I'm thankful mine was converted.
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I had an IAB business rifle made by Pedretti. It didn't have a floating chamber.
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Boy, that floating chamber sure seems like more trouble than it's worth. I'm thankful mine was converted.
I had no problem with mine. I cleaned it well everytime I fired it. Plenty of lube in the cartridges helps. I saw no reason to spend the money to do the chamber conversion.
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I had an IAB business rifle made by Pedretti. It didn't have a floating chamber.
I think those IAB rifles were as close to original as you can get. I believe the chamber capacity was even bigger than anything currently made.
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I had an IAB business rifle made by Pedretti. It didn't have a floating chamber.
I think those IAB rifles were as close to original as you can get. I believe the chamber capacity was even bigger than anything currently made.
Maybe in looks. The lever tension spring was a coil spring with a detent ball instead of a leaf spring. The bore was oversize and yeah the chamber capacity was 110 grains. The CCH was beautiful and it was very accurate. If anybody had made brass shells for them I would probably still have mine. I got tired of rolling paper cartridges for it. Pedersoli's were too small.
(https://i.imgur.com/BnE15pSl.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/HO3viU9l.jpg)
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Plenty of lube in the cartridges helps. I saw no reason to spend the money to do the chamber conversion.
The 1859 was not a brass cartridge gun. Paper cartridge. :)
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Boy, that floating chamber sure seems like more trouble than it's worth. I'm thankful mine was converted.
My Shilo 1863 Sharps carbine and my unconverted original Sharps 1863 sharps carbine do not have a gloating chamber.
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I have 10 of the brass "cartridges" for mine and I've never used them. I bought them from Buffalo Arms thinking they would make life easier. Unfortunately they don't fit my gun. Maybe it's because of the Hahn modification, but they are too big and won't fit. I'm actually glad, because making paper cartridges is half the fun of having a Paper Cutter. At least for me.
But it was an expensive lesson. Now I have 10 cartridges that I'll never use.
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I hated rolling paper cartridges. That's why I don't have mine anymore.
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I hated rolling paper cartridges. That's why I don't have mine anymore.
That actually surprises me Hawg. You're very much a "historical-ness" guy. I know how much you like originality. I figured making paper cartridges would be right up your alley.
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I shot mostly loose powder in my Sharps when I had it. I didn't know much about rolling paper cartridges then; it was long before computers. I did have a couple of books that described the process though.
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I hated rolling paper cartridges. That's why I don't have mine anymore.
That actually surprises me Hawg. You're very much a "historical-ness" guy. I know how much you like originality. I figured making paper cartridges would be right up your alley.
I love shooting them. I just hate rolling them. I'm sure not many folks back in the day rolled their own.
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I hated rolling paper cartridges. That's why I don't have mine anymore.
That actually surprises me Hawg. You're very much a "historical-ness" guy. I know how much you like originality. I figured making paper cartridges would be right up your alley.
I love shooting them. I just hate rolling them. I'm sure not many folks back in the day rolled their own.
I'd venture a guess and say you're 100% correct.