Model '94 .38-55

[LonesomePigeon]

There sure is a lot of info. I found this method http://www.castbullet.com/misc/hspace.htm wherein you  seat a fired primer into a new brass case by inserting into the chamber and closing the bolt, the bolt then seats the primer and you can see how much the primer sticks out.

Using the method above the primers do stick out about .017 - .020". If I ad the rim thickness of new Starline brass which is about about .059" I got a rough estimate of headspace somewhere between .076 - .079".

I also found this guy, Winchester Bob's Gun Shop http://www.gun-parts.com/winchesterrifle/ and he sells an Oversize Lock Bolt that is .010" oversize for $60.

Do you think I should buy the Oversize Lock Bolt? Would it be very hard to install?

[LonesomePigeon]

Got around to slugging the bore on my '94.

I took a pure lead bullet made with the Ideal loading tool, these bullets drop at .377".

I ran it through the sizer which is on the Ideal tool, this sized the bullet to .375".

Then I lubed the bore with Ballistol and lubed the bullet with beeswax/lambfat.

The bullet could be easily pressed into the bore with just my fingers. There was some resistance but it was minimal.

Once the bullet was started in the bore I used a rubber mallet and a 6" section of dowel to tap it down the bore. Then I added another 6" section of dowel to tap it further. Once the bullet was 12" down the bore it was going down so easy I just used a long section of dowel to push it all the way through without even needing to use the mallet.

When the bullet was out I measured it and it was still .375" and only showed minimal tracings of the rifling.

Thus it would appear that the .375" bullets are not large enough in diameter to fully engage the rifling all the way to the bottom of the grooves.

[Hawg]

Try one at .377

[Hawg]

What Scoob said. An alloy bullet will drop from the mold bigger than a pure lead bullet.

[LonesomePigeon]

Thanks for the advice. There is a gun show this weekend and I think I am going to look for and old Winchester mold. Last time I was there I saw some but had no use for them. I will probably end up taking the gun to a local gunsmith and see what he says about the headspace issue.

[bigted]

Lonesom, the 38-55's originally were 38 cal. They will go from .380 to some as big as .386. Take a .454 soft lead ball and use good red auto grease, grease the bore heavily and the ball. Set it on the crown and using a brass hammer, tap it into your barrel. Using a drift smaller then the bore, start it down the barrel. Now drive it thru to the breech ... will not take much to drive it on through.

Betcha you find a slightly oversize groove diameter [ top of the lands engraved on the PURE lead slug.

[LonesomePigeon]

I will do that bigted. Actually I have a .424 round ball mold so I will cast a pure lead ball with that, it should be easier than a .454 yet still work. I have called a local gunsmith but he has not called me back yet. If it comes down to it I would be willing to rebarrel this rifle. Not sure whether a rebarrel would be preferable to relining. At least with I rebarrel I guess I could keep the original barrel.

[LonesomePigeon]

Hello again. I ended up sending the gun to a local gunsmith and he said it needs an oversize lock bolt. Right now we are waiting on the part but I get the feeling he's put me on the back burner. Maybe if I can find the part it will help move things forward. Does anybody know where you can get oversize lock bolts?

I checked a place called Homestead parts but they list them as out of stock. Anyplace else?

[mazo kid]

Starline brass has thinner neck? I disagree on that point.
http://www.shilohrifle.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=21352&sid=86463f6987267cb194b26ee7e1dc872c
We use Win. brass in 45-70/45-90 rounds as it holds more powder (thinner case wall) than other brass. Also strange that the chamber seems to swage the bullet when the bore is much bigger.

[LonesomePigeon]

Another update. I will most likely be rebarrelling it with a custom barrel from winchesterbarrels.com. It's not cheap but the new barrel would have same length, same balance and taper, same rifling and same markings as the original. 

[AntiqueSledMan]

Hello Pigeon,

Before you re-barrel try a .379 bullet. I always thought this was the correct diameter for the original 38-55.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.38-55_Winchester

Also, a soft bullet might not work so well. I have an Model 1893 Marlin chambered in 32-40 which key-holed
my bullets of 7 parts wheel weights & 1 part 60/40 solder, I switched to 4 parts wheel weights & 1 part 60/40
solder and they shoot fine as did jacketed.

Nice looking old girl, keep it as original as possible.

AntiqueSledMan.

[LonesomePigeon]

AntiqueSledMan, I appreciate the sentiment of keeping it original but I also want to use it.  I am told a new barrel will also be able to eliminate the headspace issues. If the gun was not already been refinished I would not do it. Since the gun has already been refinished I feel okay about rebarreling. Plus my Grandpa who is 99 said he approves!

[LonesomePigeon]

Another update. Earlier I said the gun has a hitch in the action. I have discovered the cause and hopefully these pictures will help describe it. Basicly, when you bring the lever up to close the action, the bottom of the bolt hits the top of the hammer.

I "borrowed" these pics from EBay to show the problem. The red circles show where it's hitting.

[Captainkirk]

Should be an easy fix, then!

[LonesomePigeon]

Yes Captain, I think it would be fairly easy to at least polish those areas to make it not so jarring.

Scooby, on some of the more modern '94's I've handled, such as ones from the 1950's, it was not nearly as bad. In fact I didn't notice any resistance on those ones at all. I wonder if Winchester improved the angles of those surfaces later on. Anyway, I am glad to hear it's normal because I was worried that it might have caused some sort of damage.