navy arms co 1851

[AlaskanGuy]

Hello guys..

So I have this (what i believe to be)  1851 Navy 36cal that is pretty rough shape. it was imported from uberti by Navy Arms Corp and I believe it may be one of the first run replica's possibly from 1959 ish. it has 59 stamped on the cylendar and on the pistol and has a serial number of 1379. it does not have the 2 letter grafitti that represents the usual date code..

here is what it looks like.
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my question is, I may have access to to a Man with no name conversion cylinder, hammer, loading gate and parts to do the conversion. the bore on the gun that I have is decent shape. is this gun a collector even in the shape that its in? and what about that "man with no name" conversion.  i searched the forum and see a few times it is mentioned. i understand the history I think. is this something that I should not consider? or.....???

thanks for the tips.. and forgive me in advance if I dont have all my facts straight. remember Purty means nothing to me, but functional tools mean everything. i use all my guns in hostile environment as tools.. they get scratched up. i dont mind.

thanks again..

AG

[ShotgunDave]

AG, if that really is an early gun, it could be worth a pretty penny. You could sell it and have enough to get an actual MWNN pistol and some left over maybe.

With that said, the MWNN is a .38 I believe. You'd need the barrel to go with it. The .36 cal barrel is probably .375 and the .38 is .357 so that .38 bullet will go bouncing down that .36 barrel like a hot dog in a hallway. Accuracy will be crap.

[Hawg]

AG, if that really is an early gun, it could be worth a pretty penny. You could sell it and have enough to get an actual MWNN pistol and some left over maybe.

With that said, the MWNN is a .38 I believe. You'd need the barrel to go with it. The .36 cal barrel is probably .375 and the .38 is .357 so that .38 bullet will go bouncing down that .36 barrel like a hot dog in a hallway. Accuracy will be crap.

All Italian guns exported since 1945 have a date code. If it doesn't it was a kit gun or it was removed. A lot of people report good groups using .357 bullets. It doesn't seem like they would obdurate enough but apparently they do. Another recourse is to use hollow based wad cutters or bite the bullet and get set up for using heeled bullets like the original conversions used.

[ssb73q]

AG, if that really is an early gun, it could be worth a pretty penny. You could sell it and have enough to get an actual MWNN pistol and some left over maybe.

With that said, the MWNN is a .38 I believe. You'd need the barrel to go with it. The .36 cal barrel is probably .375 and the .38 is .357 so that .38 bullet will go bouncing down that .36 barrel like a hot dog in a hallway. Accuracy will be crap.

Hi Dave, I shoot HBWC 0.358" bullets in my .36 (0.375") revolvers with excellent accuracy. Most will group <2" from 25yds with a two hand hold. The only downside to wadcutters is the low velocity imposed by the hollow based design. If good accuracy using higher velocity is desired one can use bore sized heeled bullets, 38 Colt.

Regards,
Richard

[ssb73q]

Hi AG, IMO used razor blades may have more value than an old Navy Arms revolver. If it's anything like the used Navy Arms barrel I recently purchased from eBay, the finish sucks and is "b" grade:

http://blackpowdersmoke.com/colt/index.php?topic=3200.msg33716#msg33716
http://blackpowdersmoke.com/colt/index.php?topic=3200.msg33753#msg33753
http://blackpowdersmoke.com/colt/index.php?topic=3200.msg33819#msg33819

IMO shoot it, or recycle it.

Regards,
Richard

[AlaskanGuy]

My Navy is stamped exactly like the gun in this

https://www.riverjunction.com/z-Sold-GREAT-DEAL-First-Year-of-Production-Navy-Arms-1851-Navy-Revolver_p_2164.html

how do I figure this out for sure? more pictures???

[Hawg]

Fingers might know something about it but the government proofs and date code are mandatory on all guns exported from Italy. I don't see how it would have gotten by without them.

[AlaskanGuy]

well, aparently mine is not the only one back then. in doing research, i have seen many online that dont have the codes in the little box... but like I said, it does have a date code i  numbers on the cylinder and the frame.

[bigted]

AG ... I would really hesitate grinding, gouging or any modification to it until you determine what the value is.

Price of a MWNN revolver is cheap and then you will have a 38 Special made revolver that is purpose made with the proper barrel dimensions.

Having said this, if the value is not there, I would and have, carry on with the conversion. The hollow base wadcutters do very well in mine when loaded to no more then 750 FPS and under. There are also many heeled bullet molds available from Accurate Molds (Tom makes em very well and affordable to boot). By running the cylinder on out the end the same cylinder diameter, you can load short 38 special cases with those heeled bullets. These should be able to be pushed a bit harder.

[Fielder]

AG, if that really is an early gun, it could be worth a pretty penny. You could sell it and have enough to get an actual MWNN pistol and some left over maybe.

With that said, the MWNN is a .38 I believe. You'd need the barrel to go with it. The .36 cal barrel is probably .375 and the .38 is .357 so that .38 bullet will go bouncing down that .36 barrel like a hot dog in a hallway. Accuracy will be crap.

Hi Dave, I shoot HBWC 0.358" bullets in my .36 (0.375") revolvers with excellent accuracy. Most will group <2" from 25yds with a two hand hold. The only downside to wadcutters is the low velocity imposed by the hollow based design. If good accuracy using higher velocity is desired one can use bore sized heeled bullets, 38 Colt.

Regards,
Richard

thanks, Richard (ssb73q). I did some googling on 'loading 38 Colt 148gr HBWC' and found other  people were doing that too with good accuracy like you said. I might get me a Colt .36 percussion and give the HBWC a try!
for instance:
https://gunsmagazine.com/gear/38-long-colt/

[StrawHat]

...All Italian guns exported since 1945 have a date code...

No, they don’t.

The earliest Uberti’s will be stamped with a script G U on the right side of the barrel. It stands for Gregorelli and Uberti. There may or may not be a date code on the early ones.

If the OP has a G&U, it may be worth a bit more than a later made Uberti based on condition and if it is a rare variation. Otherwise, convert it if you want to. Before I would mess with barrel liners or hbwc for mediocre accuracy, I would convert it to 41 Colt with the internal lubed bullet.

Kevin

[ShotgunDave]

I actually own this pistol now. I acquired it from Alaskanguy shortly after the original post. I can attest to the fact that, it does not have any date code on it anywhere. And after talking to a few other people that are knowledgeable on G.U. guns, we've come to the consensus that this gun was made in the first year of production, 1959. It has a very low serial number. Gregorelli and Uberti did not date code their guns until 1961.

The gun was in perfect mechanical condition, and shoots well. The cosmetics on the other hand were not so good. It was determined that the gun has zero collector value. Therefore, I used it to make a gun I've always wanted but can not find. A .36 caliber Dance and Brothers. The original G.U. markings are still on it for now.

Here is it's current state.

[AlaskanGuy]

very purty... looks just cool....