A little more on soy wax

[Navy Six]

I used to favor lube cookies when loading black powder cartridges used at Cowboy Matches. Theory was for extended shooting over an entire Match to reduce fouling issues. Since I like to experiment, I recently loaded up some 45 Colt and 45 S&W cartridges(using 28 grs and 24 grs of 3F Swiss), Accurate Molds 45-195B, with the remainder of the cases filled with straight soy wax beads. After shooting all 50 rounds through an Uberti 1860 Army/Kirst cylinder conversion, I found the results interesting. First, there was a large, very wet lube star at the muzzle. Also the bore had less fouling than I would have expected and in fact was pretty clear of heavy powder residue. These results were good enough to encourage me to continue trying these soy wax beads in my percussion pistols, as one of our members, Lyle, reported on a while ago.
I did a little research and found there is more than one soy wax. Two specific types were mentioned, 444 and 464, with 444 having a higher melting temperature. My bag of beads didn't distinguish what it contained. The convenience was the fact there was nothing to mix if you can use the beads in that form.

[Miguel Loco]

Great info! Thanks for sharing it!

[mike116]

Navy Six,       did you use a card wad or anything between powder and the soy wax?     I use lube cookies in BP cartridges (both paper and brass).   Using wax beads as filler and lube seems like an easy, simple idea.   If the card wad is not necessary that would eliminate another component that has to be made and added to the loading process.

[Steamburn]

NavySix,
Excellent!
May you please reveal where did you purchase the soy beads?  I want to give it a try.
Thanks.

[G Dog]

Blackie Thomas in his Percussion Revolver Series uses those soy beads in his making of paper carts.  He just puts about five or so on top of the powder,  then a ball and twists it closed.  He calls the beads pearls.  I’ve tried that and also by using thin shavings of bee’s wax.  It seems to work pretty well.  Those are the only ways I know of getting lube inside a cig paper cart without contaminating the powder and/or wrecking the paper.

Does wax of itsself act as a lube and fouling softener?

Captain from ten years ago:

“Then 8-10 Tablespoons of Olive Oil/soy oil
The Olive oil is the Lube the Waxes just carry it and keep the pill as
you want it.(consistacey/hard or soft...climate time).”

https://coltcountryforum.com/index.php/topic,194.msg715.html#msg715

[Captainkirk]

Blackie Thomas in his Percussion Revolver Series uses those soy beads in his making of paper carts.  He just puts about five or so on top of the powder,  then a ball and twists it closed.  He calls the beads pearls.  I’ve tried that and also by using thin shavings of bee’s wax.  It seems to work pretty well.  Those are the only ways I know of getting lube inside a cig paper cart without contaminating the powder and/or wrecking the paper.

Does wax of itsself act as a lube and fouling softener?

Captain from ten years ago:

“Then 8-10 Tablespoons of Olive Oil/soy oil
The Olive oil is the Lube the Waxes just carry it and keep the pill as
you want it.(consistacey/hard or soft...climate time).”

https://coltcountryforum.com/index.php/topic,194.msg715.html#msg715

Yep. That was Smokin' Gun's recipe. I tried it and it worked pretty well, along with Emmert's lube pills (there's a recipe for that floating around here as well)

[Clydesdale4x4]

Blackie Thomas in his Percussion Revolver Series uses those soy beads in his making of paper carts.  He just puts about five or so on top of the powder,  then a ball and twists it closed.  He calls the beads pearls.  I’ve tried that and also by using thin shavings of bee’s wax.  It seems to work pretty well.  Those are the only ways I know of getting lube inside a cig paper cart without contaminating the powder and/or wrecking the paper.

Does wax of itsself act as a lube and fouling softener?

Captain from ten years ago:

“Then 8-10 Tablespoons of Olive Oil/soy oil
The Olive oil is the Lube the Waxes just carry it and keep the pill as
you want it.(consistacey/hard or soft...climate time).”

https://coltcountryforum.com/index.php/topic,194.msg715.html#msg715

Yep. That was Smokin' Gun's recipe. I tried it and it worked pretty well, along with Emmert's lube pills (there's a recipe for that floating around here as well)

No longer floating.

https://coltcountryforum.com/index.php/topic,195.msg716/topicseen.html#msg716

Maybe, IDK, just a thought, Make a sticky, with these and the Gatofeo #1 recipe pinned, so one has all the lube recipe's at their finger tips.

Ugly Cat Numero Uno (dig that reverse mix of English and Spanish? hahhahaha Clever, eh?)
Gato Feo #1
GATO FEO LUBE
*******************

by weight, double boiler melted ...

1 part mutton tallow (dixie gun works - soon to be reoffered in 2019)
1 part paraffin canning wax (gulf)
1/2 part filtered PURE beeswax

"but isn't paraffin canning wax a petroleum product"?

a chemist provided what seems a plausible answer:
PURE canning paraffin lacks the hydrocarbons found in other petroleum products.
apparently, these hydrocarbons are the offenders with black powder guns.

Making GF#1 ...

[Navy Six]

Mike, I did use a wax paper wad on top of the powder as I didn't know if the soy wax beads would "weep", and if so how long would that take? I intend to load up more 45 Colt cartridges and put them aside and fire a few over the course of a year to determine if there was any contamination.
Steamburn, I forgot which company I purchased the 5 lb. bag soy wax beads from, however, this may help:
Millennium Soy Wax
American Soy Organics
www.americansoywax.com

[G Dog]

I’ll second the motion on Sticky Status for Ugly Cat’s #1 and other mixes.

[Steamburn]

Thank you Navy6.  Found them in Amazon....$22/5lbs.
I have been using a mix 50/50 of Beeswax and Crisco for quite few years and have tested it for longevity in paper cartridges.  IIRC, the max I have left them is 3 months and at the end of the period I tested them and found no problems.  Maybe the formulas that have liquid oil are the perceived problem.

[Navy Six]

Thank you Navy6.  Found them in Amazon....$22/5lbs.
I have been using a mix 50/50 of Beeswax and Crisco for quite few years and have tested it for longevity in paper cartridges.  IIRC, the max I have left them is 3 months and at the end of the period I tested them and found no problems.  Maybe the formulas that have liquid oil are the perceived problem.

Steamburn, I have paper cartridges that included Gatofeo's lube mix that show no paper contamination after three YEARS. However, shooting some the other day I noticed the lube was drying out a bit. I don't know if there is a "best" lube mix as there are too many variables--what exactly are you expecting the lube to do under what conditions? That is why I like to experiment and why, after testing a myriad of lube mixtures I still wanted to try the soy wax straight up. In regard to mixtures that contain some form of liquid oil, I will reference Paul Matthews' excellent book on black powder lubes. Mr. Matthews used a lot of castor oil and neats foot oil in his experiments and found that about 40% oil was as high as you could go without worrying about powder contamination through "weepage" in long range black powder cartridges.

[G Dog]

I’m interested in this statement from Captain / Smoking Gun:

“The Olive oil is the Lube the Waxes just carry it …”

Also, Lyle said in another post that

“Beeswax is not a lubricant. Soy wax is a lubricant”.

Some exegesis and gloss on the text is needed, you know, what does that mean? Will bee’s wax and/or surf board wax (paraffin) alone not keep fouling soft?  I think that it does but I may have been wrong all my life, it happens.

[AntiqueSledMan]

Hello G Dog,

I can't answer your question but have been following this thread.

When I first started loading the .44 Colt for my Pietta 1858,
I used 1/4 pound of Bees Wax, 1/4 pound of Paraffin, and 3/4 cup of Crisco.
I then poured it into a 3/4" tube and let it set.
It made a nice little stick which could be pressed into the grooves with my homemade lubricator.
I think without the Crisco, the Bees Wax and Paraffin would just be to hard to do anything with in its natural state.

AntiqueSledMan.