Bluing and Plating

[ssb73q]

Hi, this thread is being started to discuss different bluing methods that can be used by the home hobbyist. The first method is new to me, nitre bluing. Nitre bluing is done at ~650-degrees F by placing steel part in salts of sodium nitrate. The nitre bluing comes from the temperature, not the bluing salts. It is used mostly for small steel parts, not large parts. It can also be used for tempering steel.

This is a nice video that describes nitre bluing:


This is the nitre bluing salts ordered:
http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-tools-supplies/metal-prep-coloring/metal-bluing/bluing-salts/nitreblue-bluing-salts-prod1105.aspx

The Brownells instructions for NitreBlue Blluing:
https://www.brownells.com/userdocs/learn/Inst-362%20Nitre%20Bluing%20Bluing.pdf

This is the Lee pot I ordered for the nitre bluing:
http://www.amazon.com/Lee-Precision-Magnum-Melter-Grey/dp/B00162RW52/ref=sr_1_1?s=sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1461496387&sr=1-1&keywords=Lee+Precision+Magnum+Melter

Regards,
Richard
 

[ssb73q]

Hi, guess there's little interest in bluing?

Well how about discussing cold bluing. For years I have used the Blue Wonder cold blue. It worked reasonably well for small touch ups, but it always left me cold (a pun). It was difficult to evenly cover a large area. It was the Captain that brought my attention to Brownells Oxpho-Blue. I must admit, I didn't know what I was missing. That Oxpho-Blue works great, blues evenly, and produces a deep rich blue. I have both the liquid and creme, but have only used the creme.

What cold blue do you use for bluing and how well does it work?

Regards,
Richard

[mazo kid]

Richard, I had always thought about the nitre bluing, but just never got interested enough to purchase the stuff needed. Like you, I had so-so success with commercial cold blue products until OxphoBlue. I have only used the liquid, couldn't find the cream. A friend will be going to the long range BPR shoot in June and will get me whatever is available there. My bottle is about empty now. I bought a bottle of Birchwood-Casey Super Blue, but have not tried it because I liked the OxphoBlue so much. I bought an old toaster oven at a garage sale a few years ago for a couple of $ and have that in my shop. I heat small parts in it for about 10-15 minutes at the lowest setting before applying the blue. Instant color change! Then a wipe down with oil and it is finished.
Oh, and I also use the toaster oven for pan lubing cast bullets.

[ssb73q]

Hi, I'm still thinking on how to refinish a brass frame .44 Pietta 1851 that should arrive this week. Doing nickel plating would be a slam-dunk, but I'm thinking about finishing the steel parts in copper plate. Some guns used on TV back in the old days of black and white TV had the guns finished in copper to allow the gun to show up well. Images of some of those old copper plated handguns look cool to me. The copper can be left bright or allowed to develop an aged patina.

While nickel plating is easy on steel, copper plating isn't. Iron (steel) placed in a bath of copper sulfate salts cause the surface of the iron to be replaced by copper without doing anything other than dunking the iron part in the bath. The problem is that the copper doesn't adhere well to the iron surface. Electroplating with a tough copper coating normally requires dangerous cyanide salts, something I won't screw around with.

A strike under-coat plate of nickel could be done, then plate the copper with copper sulfate salt bath is a solution (pun). There may be some other solutions. This is one method to create a tough copper strike plate:



The necessary chemicals have been received. Tests coming soon.

Regards,
Richard

[Captainkirk]

For some reason I didn't see this thread before?
Richard, I'm VERY interested in bluing and everything you're doing with this Walker. I'm glad you like the Oxpho Blue, I think it's top drawer.

[ssb73q]

Hi, I copper plated a 1/2" steel gas pipe using the ecofriendly plating solution described before. The issue was if copper could be plated that has good retention to steel. It appears to, this is the pipe:



The area to the right was scotchbright rubbed hard and then polished with Brasso.

The plating is very inefficient taking a few hours what can be none with nickel in ten minutes. There is also a blue slime that forms on the copper anode. I ordered some carbon electrodes. The patent for this process says that it should be possible to move all the salts produced back to the copper anode by attaching the copper to the negative polarity and carbon being attached to the positive current source. All the plating was limited to 1.5A irrespective of voltage. The maximum voltage used was 12V.

I will do some more mechanical testing on the copper plate produced. If it proves to be a tough coating, it will be used on the steel parts of the .44 Pietta 1851 arriving this week.

Regards,
Richard

[ssb73q]

Hi, the brass framed Pietta .44 1851 is due to arrive today. I like the idea of copper plating the steel parts of the revolver, but somewhat concerned if copper is a good choice for plating a BP revolver. The sulfur in black powder will turn the copper black where a once beautiful revolver quickly turns to looking like crap. Of course copper plating could be protected with a clear coat varnish, but how long would that last. Maybe I should stick to nickel plating until fully motivated to have a copper revolver?

I have a couple of extra different length Pietta .44 barrels and could experiment plate on the barrel with the poorest bluing. Decisions, decisions.

Regards,
Richard

[Captainkirk]

My .02 cents?
Plate the entire revolver with copper as a base coat, then nickel as a finish coat. Many of the older nickel plated revolvers (as you well know) were first copper plated to give the nickel some adhesion. This will allow you to see what a revolver looks like copper plated (not very good IMHO) and ten make your nickel plating more durable. I think it will look excellent.
Plus, it would give the opportunity to defarb the "Pietta Billboard" from the barrel if you so choose to.
From what I've read, all the Pietta nickeled guns are factory brassers anyway.

[ssb73q]

Hi, the new $150 brass framed Pietta .44 1851 arrived yesterday:



It is perfect in every respect, fit, finish, and timing. It's going to be a sin that could justify damnation to destroy the fine bluing of this revolver. Maybe just knowing that I can turn this beautiful brasser into a pimp's special that no one would want should be enough for me? I'm not going to screw up this fine looking revolver without some more thought.

Regards,
Richard

[Captainkirk]

It is a beauty. I see the Pietta tail is now gone from the brassers as well. Somebody as been listening!

[wicket]

  I nitre blued a '61 Colt, which worked well except for the grip frame, which lost its bluing real quick. Anybody know if it's possible to plate brass onto the grip frame?

[ssb73q]

Hi wicket, the formula I used to do the copper plating is also supposed to do brass, see the claims of this patent:

http://www.google.com/patents/US7235165

Use brass as the anode. I found it interesting that the patent claims it can plate stainless steel.

Regards,
Richard

[ssb73q]

  I nitre blued a '61 Colt, which worked well except for the grip frame, which lost its bluing real quick. Anybody know if it's possible to plate brass onto the grip frame?

Hi wicket, thank you for the report on doing a full nitre bluing. I understand that while there have been full gun nitre "bluing" jobs, nitre bluing is best left to small parts like screws etc. Nitre bluing is only thin skin deep and will wear quickly. I would like to see a photo of your nitre blued 1861.

Regards,
Richard

[ssb73q]

Hi, I'm going to do a bit of experimenting on plating an extra Pietta .44 1851 barrel. The bluing was rich deep black and perfect, but the bluing has to be removed to do any plating. There were two choices I had to remove the bluing. The first is to use a 50/50% Muriatic acid/Water, or vinegar. Muriatic acid is diluted HCl and vinegar is diluted acetic acid. HCl is nasty stuff and will etch the steel so I decided on vinegar. The barrel was placed in the vinegar for 30 minutes and given a light rub with steel wool. All the bluing is now gone, see:



While the steel looks nice and bright, do you notice something ugly on that barrel? Yep, the rolled in Pietta markings. I'm going to give my hand at burnishing the markings out as StrawHat instructed:

http://blackpowdersmoke.com/colt/index.php?topic=592.msg5864#msg5864

I will post a photo of the burnishing result.

The barrel will then be polished and plated. Still not sure on what metal I will use for plating.

Regards,
Richard

[ssb73q]

Hi, I spent ~1/2 hour trying to burnish out the Pietta stampings. I used the round end of a ball peen hammer as the burnishing tool. I got most of the high metal returned level with the barrel surface, but there's still a lot more to go, see:



What has me concerned is if I slip and end up rounding one of the barrel octagon corners, that would be a disaster. I don't want to thin the barrel by filing and since the barrel will be plated, maybe I can simply fill the stamping impressions with soft solder. Then file the barrel surface flat and plate away. No one would ever know there are stamping marks under the plating. Any thoughts?

Regards,
Richard