Bluing and Plating

[ssb73q]

Hi, this is the Pietta .44 1851 barrel plated with copper using the ecofriendly plating bath:



The copper plate is thin and I think I will continue copper plating with the copper sulfate salt bath. The ecofriendly put on a strike coat where continued copper plating should do well with the sulfate bath. We will see.

That copper coat looks damn attractive, it may become the next hot setup for refinishing BP handguns?

Regards,
Richard

[wicket]

  I stopped by Home Depot today to see about finding the plating chemicals mentioned in the patent, but all I located was trisodium phosphate.

[ssb73q]

Hi, I continued copper plating the barrel using a traditional copper plating bath, copper sulfate and H2SO4. That plating bath couldn't be used on the bare steel and be a plate that sticks. The ecofriendly plating bath was required to get a sound strike plate. The copper sulfate bath plating is very efficient compared to the ecofriendly bath. This is the raw results:



I am not going polish the copper plate, but let it patina naturally. I can always polish it in the future if desired.

Regards,
Richard

[ssb73q]

Hi wicket, I got my chemicals from eBay.

Regards,
Richard

[wicket]

  I ultimately took the same approach Richard, and simply ordered both the ammonium sulfate and the oxalic acid, I'll get the TSP from the local hardware. Your copper plating appears to be proceeding well, it will be quite interesting to see how the patina develops over time. If you run out of patience you can always darken it with liver of sulfur.
 

[ssb73q]

Hi, since this is an experimental barrel, I decided to see what it looked like polished. This is the barrel with a little steel wool applied:





This is the finished barrel hit with a little Brasso:





After doing the Brasso I can see areas where the copper plate is lumpy. This shows that I copper plated too long with the copper sulfate/sulfuric acid bath.

Since this is an extra test barrel, I may strip the copper and try some other finishing method on it. Isn't science fun?

Regards,
Richard

[wicket]

  Yep, science is fun Richard.  I did some web surfing yesterday to learn more about  liver of sulfur and how it's used to antique silver, brass, and copper. I found a youtube video by a guy who dipped silver jewelry into a solution of liver of sulfur,  removed the pieces fairly quickly, and neutralized them in water. He got all sorts of color flashing from straw yellow to purple, put me in mind of color case hardening.

[ssb73q]

Hi wicket, it will be interesting to see what colors can be created by liver of sulfur. I know that just using BP with a copper plated revolver will turn it black in no time due to the sulfur content in BP.

I look forward to seeing your photos.

Regards,
Richard

[wicket]

Richard...
Something interesting I've noticed in the past is that the scoop (.30 cal carbine shell) I keep in a wide mouth plastic container with my home-made powder turns a deep blue/black over time. I thought it might be a result of acidic sulfur, so recently I switched to a non acidic sulfur, and still get the same result. As an experiment I just now put a scrap of roofing copper into the powder jar to see whether anything happens.

[99whip]

Richard,

I see you are off and running with your experiment on this .44 1851, which is looking great.  You mentioned in the original post other bluing methods the home hobbyist could do.  Lately I have been experimenting with fire bluing the heads of screws, etc.  I will post some pics of a few that I've done.  As you know it is a really simple process which is probably why I've read that it doesn't last as long, but it does look nice if they are well polished beforehand. 

Have you ever messed with fire bluing?

Whip

[ssb73q]

Hi whip, no I have never tried fire bluing. My understanding is that nitre bluing is the same as fire bluing. The nitre salts should allow better control of the temperature of the iron and steel parts than using fire. That should provide better control of the bluing color, straw to deep blue and a uniform finish. Nitre bluing is also skin deep and best used for small parts like screws, etc.

I have the salts and a new Lee lead pot to do nitre bluing, but haven't tried it yet. One of these days when I have some small parts like a wedge or screws that need bluing I will give it a try.

I look forward to seeing your photos of fire bluing.

Regards,
Richard

[99whip]

I think you're right about nitre bluing/fire bluing being the same, the processes are different but the result is similar at least cosmetically.  I believe the nitre bluing is probably more durable.  I fire blued the screw below, the shadows you see are reflection from my roof and a nearby tree.  Polished it with extremely fine wet/dry sandpaper to get it nice and shiny, buffed it with my dremel, then carefully touched it with a propane torch till it got to this color, then quenched it in oil.



The procedure for using the Brownell's salts looks really easy also and will probably provide a better result. 

Whip 

[ssb73q]

Hi whip, that looks very nice, you should be proud. IMO the problem with your method is that each part must be evaluated for the color, read slow. I'm guessing that the salt method keeps the temperature the same for a reproducible result with many parts. Even then, the color may depend on the steel composition.

Instructions for niter bluing:

https://www.brownells.com/userdocs/learn/Inst-362%20Nitre%20Bluing%20Bluing.pdf

Thanks for posting the photo.

Regards,
Richard

[wicket]

  Whip, you're quite correct about the importance of polishing before niter bluing. I've had good luck with niter bluing simply  using Spectricide stump remover melted in a rectangular tank welded up out of sheet iron and heated over a turkey fryer. The colors move quickly from straw through what I think of as peacock blue to dark blue, but with a thermometer and heat control you're not fighting the clock so much.

[99whip]

Wicket,

I have heard about the Spectricide also, which I think I might try.  I think you guys are both right about getting a better finish using a salts/consistent heat method.  How durable have you found nitre bluing to be? Reckon the stand alone burner on my gas grill will do 600 degrees?

Whip